The Koran

you are the man hasbeen. so rarely will you find someone w/ such strong beliefs that will even talk about something let alone read it. :applause:

 

going along with the salvation for good deeds

Men and women, what evil attractions have lured you from your gracious Lord, who created and fashioned you, molding your body according to his will? Yes, you deny the last judgment. Yet there are guardians watching over you, carefully recording all your actions. The righteous will surely live in bliss.

[font=VERDANA, ARIAL, SANS-SERIF]Qur'an-- Surah 82:6-13[/font]

 

This is first reference linking salvation "to those who believe" and do good deeds.
Don't forget the the first part, without which the "good deeds" are moot point.

 

You are absolutely correct, and that's a strong point.

 

However, it you believe, then the good deed simply come about. You can't believe and be an ass. You can mouth the words and be an ass, but true belief requires action. That's the difference between accepting jesus and merely trying to hedge your bets.

 

Depends on how one defines "believe", but personally I agree with you. Good deeds, or more to the point "obedience" should be the natural result of faith.

But where things get very sticky is when you try to make the reverse true as well -- i.e. if you don't obey or do good works, you don't truly believe. There are few ways to piss someone off quicker.

 

i think another fundamental aspect that seperate islam from christianity is that islam believes people are born sin-free and need to stay that way, while christianity believes people are born sinners and need to atone for their sins.

how accurate is this?

in regards to islams claim to israel... the middle east is where europe, africa and asia intersect. how could it not be an area in constant turmoil? didn't the israelies kick somebody else outta there in the bible? cananites or something?

 

I couldn't say for certain regarding Islam, but it would make sense to a degree. To start off doomed and try to earn your way in is a tough row to hoe. And to take it a step further, I don't believe it's fair.

As far as the Christian doctrine of being born sinners goes, I haven't really gotten to a place where I'm comfortable with that yet. I know at some point, it's a slam dunk bet that all of us have placed our own will above God's. But to claim that an infant is a sinner without any awareness of his own free will is a concept I haven't quite figured out yet.

They kicked several city-states out of that stretch of land. At least a dozen or more communities.

 

I just read about this today. The Israelites under Joshua killed more than 31 kings.

 

The Qur'an: The Cow

Verse 2:29

First reference to multiple heavens. I wonder if they're equal, or have varying significance...