Running Red Sox thread

Good lord, you can't even keep your own story straight for one page. What did you say in response to vpkozel's story on the Helton talks falling through? You said:

Now you want to pretend that money wasn't an issue only a couple of posts later just to disagree with me. That's awesome.

Link? Buster Olney, Gammons, and SI all said that the Rockies were just asking for one prospect off of that list they submitted to Boston.

Yes, I do, which is my whole point. Boston penny-pinched with A-Rod, Pedro, Damon, Abreu, and now Helton when they obviously don't need to. They have more than enough resources to get anyone they want, and while I do applaud them for not being insane like the Yankees (for instance, I thought letting Pedro go was a good move), it seems clear that they've been unnecessarily cheap. I thought the Matsuzaka bid represented an end to that, but apparently that was just an exception.

The fact that you would even compare Delcarmen with Hanley Ramirez and Anibal Sanchez proves how retarded you're being here. You don't think highly of Delcarmen, so you can't pretend that he was somehow a talent that Boston really needed to keep him.

 

that was with regard to "buying championships" period. whether they spend $5M, $10M or $15M a year on someone, I'd rather see the sox win with as much homegrown talent as possible.

I'm not pretending anything, there, Narcissus. You contend the deal falling through was first and foremost about money. I believe it's not.

Jan 29 Herald

The Rockies would like to obtain promising relievers Craig Hansen and Manny Delcarmen from Boston.

And

Jan 30 Globe

Also, the Rockies wanted to choose one or two players from a list of Jon Lester, Craig Hansen, Jacoby Ellsbury, Daniel Bard, Manny Delcarmen, and Clay Buchholz. The Red Sox wouldn't part with any of them. Epstein countered with more of a second-tier prospect list, and that's when the negotiations broke down.

A-Rod, Pedro and Abreu. lol. Ask the Mets how glad they are to have Pedro on their staff. You need to pick your examples better. Yankees want more than anything to be rid of A-Rod. Couldn't be happier he didn't come to Boston. They just spent a heap on a starting pitcker, a shortstop and rightfielder, you schmuck. they'll do it again on schilling. Just because they didn't give A-rod an absurdly high contract doesn't make them cheap. they low-balled Damon and it backfired. you move on.

that just plain settles it. you're a moron with serious comprehension issues. did I compare Delcarmen to Ramirez and Sanchez as players? No. Do I feel that the Sox made a mistake shipping them to Fla.? absolutely. As for Delcarmen, where did I ever say I don't think highly of him?


Look you already lost this debate. Badly, in fact. don't make it worse.

 

No, it was in response to vpkozel posting the Helton story. In less than a page you went from saying it was too much money to spend to saying it's a bargain. And let's face it, the only reason you changed stories was to disagree with me. You like that people find you amusing, but you still find it somewhat hollow and wonder what it would be like if someone, anyone cared about your opinion. So that's where your fantasy comes in that some magical day you'll actually beat me in an argument and people will look up to you and think that you actually have something worthwhile to say instead of being a perpetual punchline. Keep dreaming junior, because it ain't happening.

Yeah, I do. I find it impossible to believe that any team would pass on Todd Helton for the sake of Manny Delcarmen. It's inconceivable.

Fair enough, you gave your source. Most, however, said that Delcarmen alone would have been enough to conclude the deal and that the Red Sox pulled out. My take is that Epstein was never that keen on adding Helton to the payroll and used the prospect thing as an excuse.

I specifically said that I thought letting Pedro go was a good move, but I correctly pointed out that Boston has a lengthy recent history of cheaping out. You were in love with the idea of adding A-Rod back then, but the union wouldn't let A-Rod lower his salary and Henry was too cheap to cover the balance. Like I said, I thought Matzusaka represented a change from that recent pattern of behavior, but I guess not. Still, I'm not saying the Red Sox are in bad shape because they're obviously not. They're in great shape, but they'd look even better if they hadn't cheaped out on Eric Gagne and Todd Helton.

You made that allusion, yes. You said, "the only logical conclusion here is that the Sox wanted to hold on to their young talent. Guess they learned from the Beckett trade." If you don't think Delcarmen is a comparable talent, then the comparison is nonsense, but you made it anyway. I don't think Delcarmen is anywhere near as talented as those two guys, which is why I simply don't believe that the Red Sox were so set on keeping him that they walked away from the Helton deal. It obviously had to be something else, and that something else sure looks like money.

 

The sox just spent $209 million on three free agents. cheap? worried about money? pretending to be poor? only in Argumentative Narcissistic Blowhard Colon's world.

Olney is no Colon

ESPN: The Rockies want relief pitchers Craig Hansen and Manny Delcarmen, while the Red Sox do not want to give up either at this time.



another thing the resident genius is conveniently overlooking: Helton's numbers have been declining the last three seasons. BA dropped 45 points; RBI and HR numbers down. It can't all be attributed to some intestinal mallady last year and it goes without saying that his stats were inflated by playing in Denver.

was the decision about money? only in the context that Helton is being paid way more than he's worth. and in that context it would be foolish for the sox to overpay for Helton and give up two of their power bullpen arms.

 

too bad Tavarez won't be blowing games for some other team

 

Because I think that including Delcarmen or Hansen in the deal and still being on the hook for a good portion of Helton's salary is a bad deal. Including BOTH of them would be fucking idiotic.

If we were talking the Helton of a few years ago, I'd be all for it. But he has missed good chunks of time over the past couple of years, and his BA has been dropping. Then of course you have to ask yourself how inflated it was to begin with by playing in Denver.

And if you are asking me to explain what the hell the Sox's front office strategy seems to be, I have no earthly idea. They are all over the place. Can't say that I'm real pleased with their efforts oer the past few years.

I still think that letting Damon walk was the right call though. That contract is gonna look pretty bad in a year or two.

 

unfortunately, it won't look as bad as Coco Crisp's

 

here we go

 

hurry the fuck up. I ain't got all day

 

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