Running Red Sox thread

Collin, you are right Smoltz did not convert from starter to reliever mid-season in the major leagues. It was in the minor leagues with the Detroit Tiger organization during the season. I know because I was his set up man during that season and in instructional league along with Ramon Pena (Tony Pena's brother)
When he was acquired by the Braves he then went back to starting in Richmond along with Glavine. His experience with the Tigers ,and the knowledge of the Braves organization of his experience, prompted both parties to agree on him trying and becoming the closer for the Braves.
Orel Herschiser started as a short reliever and went through a similar experience with the Dodgers in the minor leagues.
Steve Howe started as a starter and went on to have success as a short reliever.
Dave Stewart, similar experiences.
Tim Wakefield was actually a weak hitting first baseman in the Pirates organization and was luckily found out throwing knuckle-balls in the outfield during warm-up that actually saved his career.
I was there and I did'nt have to get second hand information from anyone else.

 

I mean to tell you that of you and Applejack, there is exactly one of you who knows what it is like from a physical and mental standpoint what it is like to be a major league pitcher.

Hint, it contains the words not and you.

Are these the same folks who told you how for real the Orioles were last year?

In 2000 Wake started 17 games, finsished 28 - going 6-11 with 15 saves. In 2001, he started 17 In 2000 Wake started 17 games, finished 28 – going 6-11 with 15 saves. In 2001, he started 17, finished 5 – going 9-12 with 3 saves. In 2002, he started 15 games, finished 10 – going 11-5 with 3 saves. And, in 2003, he started 33 games finished 2 – going 11-7 with 1 save.

You’d think that somebody with all those great contacts would have heard of baseball-reference.

Oh, and the year Smoltzie made the switch to closer, he started 5 games, so you are wrong about that too. Papelbon was coming in as a conditioned as starter, so closing out a couple of games would not really be a problem. If he had been exclusively used as a closer in spring training, you might have a case. But he wasn’t, so you really don’t.

 

We are going to have to invent a whole new level of owned for that one.

 

Papelbon was a starter in high school, then became a closer at Miss. State. He started and relieved in the minors and has done both with the big club. saying he "can't make the transition" from one role to the other is stupid, regardless of how many names one has in his rolodex.


regardless of his ability to close (which, despite Colon's views to the contrary, is pretty damned good), Papelbon will eventually be in the rotation. He has the good heater and a pretty good splitter and curve to boot. The sox didn't draft Hansen to do long duty. He should be the full-time closer next season, if not sooner.

 

Actually I said he didn't convert from reliever to starter mid-season. I was specific about that because he did, in fact, convert from starter to closer during the 2001 season after having continuing problems with his elbow. He started 5 games in May and June, then missed about a month before returning as Atlanta's closer. Going from starter to closer has been done during the season a number of times, but going from reliever to starter in the same season is much more difficult because the arm isn't prepared for the additional workload. But when we're talking about players making that change during the off-season, that happens with a fair amount of frequency and doesn't appear to be that difficult. For instance, Miguel Bastista underwent that very change this off-season after being traded to Arizona.

Speaking of owned, I have some interesting data suggesting that either your memory is severely damaged or you're outright lying. Smoltz participated in 21 games with Glens Falls in 1987. He entered all 21 of those games as the starting pitcher before being traded to the Braves for Doyle Alexander. His only previous season in 1986 was also spent as a starting pitcher, with him starting 14 of the 17 games he appeared in. John Smoltz did not have any saves at all in his minor league career.


Does anyone know for sure that Applejack played in the major leagues or are we just taking his word for it? The fact that he would lie about being set-up man for Smoltz in the minor leagues has very troubling implications for the rest of his claims.

Apparently you weren't there or you wouldn't have screwed up your lie so badly.


vpkozel:
See above. You might want to rethink who just got owned. Moreover, surely you're enough of a Boston fan to know that Wakefield only served as closer for about two months in 1999 following the injury to Tom Gordon. Derek Lowe subsequently replaced him, and that's the last time he's been used in that role. The other saves are almost all a result of entering games with a lead and pitching multiple innings to finish them out. You do realize that you get a save if you come in with a three run lead or less and finish off the rest of the game even if you enter in the sixth inning, right?

 

You think it bothers me that you question who I am?

 

If you did play professional baseball, I think that's cool as hell and I'm extremely envious. That said, for you to lie about what Smoltz did just to win an internet argument was pretty low. It was pretty stupid too, considering that such an obvious lie destroyed what credibility you had.

 

Why would I have to lie about something like that Collin?
Do you think I'm trying to impress you?
I don't need you to validify me.
You're just an envious, argumentitive, internet junkie that's seeking attention.

 

You wouldn't, which is what makes your decision to do so even more stupid. Use any source you want to, but Smoltz appeared in 38 games with Detroit's minor league clubs, started 35 of them, and didn't save any. You lied.


Oh, and by the way, no pitcher from Smoltz's 1987 Glens Falls team went on to reach the major leagues.

 

Who does everybody have the Extra Innings package with? The game was posted as "blackout" on TW digital cable, but the game was on when I flipped to the channel. The screen went black right as Trot's homer was settling into right center field.