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Projected team strength and weaknesses

Discussion in 'Carolina Panthers' started by Thelt, May 26, 2005.

  1. Collin

    Collin soap and water

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    No, I'm saying this is separate from whether or not Davis can play SLB and have said that for quite a while now. I'm pointing out the FACT that you simply cannot admit when you're wrong.


    Just answer a simple yes or no question.

    Are John Fox and Mark Richt wrong about Thomas Davis being like Derrick Brooks?

    Just answer the question. Yes or no.
     
  2. magnus

    magnus Chump-proof

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    I explained myself and repeated what I said. You want to twist it into some unrelated bullshit? Knock yourself out, but since it's irrelevant, I'm not going to answer some schoolyard dare. Sorry. Not responsible for you not liking the answer.
     
  3. Black&Blue

    Black&Blue NKW

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    Okay, but please explain how my opinion of one player is twisted into me lying about something else? You've been taking that quote so far out of context that it's silly. What it meant was that we shouldn't automatically eliminate Davis from one position because of his very womanly 230 lb. frame. I'm sure the coaches will further evaluate his abilities at LB and safety to find out when he fits in the best, instead of completly eliminating him from one spot without doing so. I don't mean that every undersized LB can swith to the strongside.

    No, they aren't. Now you're just making up things to cover for the holes in your position.

    Nope. LB's have become less physical over time. Speed and versatility are now at a premium. It's just an evolution in the game, not my own magic theory. I wouldn't waste time making something up like this.
     
  4. Collin

    Collin soap and water

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    Yes or no. It's very, very simple. Do you have the courage to answer? I'm betting that you don't.



    Black&Blue:
    You and Magnus have the same problem. You don't want to face up to your own quotes. You said, "The whole size thing doesn't have much to stand on" You were suggesting that there were many examples of players Davis' size who played strongside linebacker. You're now admitting that it isn't true, but can't quite own up to your mistake, so you have to pretend that you didn't say the thing that was wrong in the first place.

    You couldn't be more wrong. Physicality has increased, hence the greater number of injuries from collisions. Seriously, they've documented this in their studies of helmet construction. Why do you think they invented all these new types, because they looked cooler? So obviously you did make it up, whether or not your motivation was conscious or subconscious. I don't know and don't particularly care.
     
  5. vpkozel

    vpkozel Professional Calvinballer

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    Davis is no Pujols, that's for sure.
     
  6. magnus

    magnus Chump-proof

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    Naturally, I'm not going to cater to your every need when the concern has left any actual argument and is now simply you re-iterating a dickwagging question I've explained in the tenor of the actual argument now, a dozen times. Don't like the answer? Don't like the opinion? Try dealing with it. I stand behind what I've said, though not your interpretation of it apparently.

    Ooh. Maybe I can play this game - I don't think you're man enough to get over it. If you don't get over this, you're a little boy in a man's world. Maybe getting over it would make that second testicle descend, etc.


    By the way, the whole sidebar you and B&B have going, you two aren't really arguing the same thing. Both of your points are plausible without the other being wrong - and he's correct in that speed and versatility are becoming increasingly wanted, regardless of the rash of tweeners. That said, this recent trend of tweeners far outmatches the crop that emerged around the last time the 3-4 was a fad.
     
  7. Black&Blue

    Black&Blue NKW

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    I never suggested that there are many examples of it, never. You will not find that anywhere. What I did show you is that players of his size or close enough to his size have played the position. They were all true, each one of those guys had experience at that position. So it has happened, which is what I was trying to illustrate.

    You said, "The whole size thing doesn't have much to stand on"

    I did. It's nice to see you put down something I actually did say. But again, you've taken it out of context. You've made it look like the quote disagrees with the basic concept that strongside players are generally bigger than weakside players. The quote was pertaining to Thomas Davis, not to any linebacker in the NFL. So why doesn't it have much to stand on?

    1) Thomas Davis has played the position.
    2) Thomas Davis has gained weight.
    3) Thomas Davis is 5-10 pounds lighter than players at that position. It's not out of the realm of possibility that he can gain that much, or more.
    4) If Thomas Davis does gain 5-10 pounds, he'll be heavier than our weakside linebacker.

    It doesn't have much to stand on because of the possability that he could gain or lose weight, nor do we know if the coaches want him to do either. That's really the crux of what I'm saying. There is no reason to totally eliminate him from playing the strongside. Fox has never said he won't. Trgo has never said he won't. Mark Richt, who has played him at strongside linebacker, never said he won't. So you have a argument based on quotes and stats. There is nothing wrong with that. In fact, you make a pretty good case as to why you think he should play at a certain position. But until someone involved with the team says he's limited to one poistion or another, it's only an argument. It doesn't make everything contrary to what you've said wrong. Maybe in your mind, but not in reality.


    BTW, I do make mistakes. When I do, I'll owe up to them. But having an opinion that happens to contrast with yours is not a mistake, so I owe you nothing.
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2005
  8. magnus

    magnus Chump-proof

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    Yeah, but Richt was obviously wrong.
    :satana:


    By the way, Georgia LB Derrick White was dismissed, meaning that whoever replaces him will be the next Georgia LB we draft. :banginghe
     
  9. HeadCase

    HeadCase dazed and confused

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    >>During this "debate" about some kind of fall from Del Rio to Trgovac, you kept saying things like "The Panthers D last year was a microspec of what it the prior two years." That indicates that you thought Del Rio was here those prior two years when he wasn't.

    I clearly explained to you that I did not think Del Rio was here during our SB run and that I think that Trog may have benefitted from what Del Rio built. Others with a smidgen of your brilliance were able to grasp the concept and discuss.

    >> Microspec is not a word.

    Your joking right? Most everybody here but maybe you takes liberty with the english language and makes up words for the fun of it. Did it throw your peabrain so much that you couldn't figure out the what i meant? Or was it just something to try to turn attention from your stupid comment that i called you on? I will grant you that you can write with the best and have an excellent wit. But you have no common sense and certainly no manners that i can tell. I'm assuming you grew up on a pig farm.

    >> it's even possible to explain it to you.

    and it apparently is impossible for you to clarify your remark that I called BS ... again, in case you have forgotten, you said that our D was as good as when Del Rio left. Since you have yet to offer any explanation to the contrary or clarification of why you would say such a thing, I have to assume you were caught in blantantly stupid comment, and i have to assume that you agree that last year's D was not as good when Del Rio was here as you have yet to call me an idiot for saying it wasn't. It doesn't surprise me as you seem to be at ease making such dumb comments and then forgetting or ignoring you said them BUT then you tell us too that history supports you as being much more correct than anyone else. Again, I am leaning toward believing that your have convenient amnesia when you were wrong even though you are grossly opinionated and called all idiots that didn't succumb to your reasoning, or lack thereof as I tend to find with most of your thinking. You told us you were leaving after the draft so I didn't keep up with all your predictions as I planned so I could honestly test your opinion of yourself as a draft know-it-all but I will go back and put together such a list. For starters I know I can throw on the list Elton Brown as a guy you opined that we shoulda picked at 14 as he was with certainty a franchise guard (yet all clubs talent personnel apparently strongly disagreed with you), and that only an idiot would consider drafting Thomas Davis as a Panther. On both accounts Mags disagreed with you so I'm thinking that Mags still remains by far the best on this board at evaluating talent and you are plodding so far in the distance that you're only sniffing the asses of most, if not all, other posters here too.
     
  10. magnus

    magnus Chump-proof

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    it's hard to honestly say what to do with JDR v/s Trgovac. Honestly, I still put the greater portion of the push on Fox...I got caught up in the Jack hype, but that defense wasn't anywhere near dominant. The 03 wasn't either. They were ranking-rich, but they were terribly deficient in areas, most namely picks. They seemed to emphasize that last year, and we led the league, but with an intact secondary we still sucked at the pass. We didn't have the deficiencies that the O did, either, and we still sucked.

    Trgovac's average. He's learning. And I still feel like both he and JDR benefitted intensely from Fox, moreso than that either were elite coordinators. I do think that Trgo wants to blitz more, he certainly seemed more in tune to the cover three type stuff we ran more last year, and they mesh well together.

    I'm very much glad we decided on him rather than Mora. Can't stand the bitch. Glad, in retrospect, that Sam turned it down. Trgo has this year, with tons of talent, to see if he can overmatch people. He can't create brilliance with mediocre talent, which isn't "expected" but hoped; that he should exceed with above average talent, that he should be able to not be overmatched for the rest of his tenure, that's more expected.

    As an instance, a guy like Henning showed he can adapt and succeed, without his necessary pieces. He proved some things to me this year, but it only makes me that much more stressed that our team can be balanced, successful, and powerful with mediocre talent, but will waste exceptional talent with three dives behind right guard.


    Elton Brown, Thomas Davis? Yeah, I guess I can claim that. I liked both, but when Brown comes in with man-tits and injures himself immediately, I worry some. He just kept going downhill from there, but I never found him franchise-ish.

    I also liked Jamaal Brown, who the team fancied over Barron.
    But I thought Rodgers would go before Smith, who I didn't feel was a top 10 guy. So shit happens all around, either way. That said, I do think Collin gets himself in trouble with the superlative, in an effort to annihilate the other side of an opinion. Things change, and situations don't always work out exactly as planned, so ruling things out or supposing consensus opinion without it existing? That doesn't work out well.
     

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