Panthers/Giants game thread

By the end I was saying how much I loved 60 (Grigsby). I know you can't tell a great deal from the bottom of the depth chart for both teams, but the guy came to play ball. I'd love to have someone with his enthusiasm/hustle on the roster.

 

He's worth keeping just so we can have a guy named 'Otis' on the team.

 

Watching the games on NFLN, here are some random thoughts.

I mentioned in another thread, Seward was active. He made a couple of breaks on passes, made a couple of nice tackles, wasn't out of position at all. Encouraging, keep it up and I wouldn't feel bad at all about having him backing up Morgan when the inevitable happens.

Robinson I thought showed some elusiveness. Saw more in his receptions, but he seems to have a nice feel where to go in the open field.

I like Carr when he plants and goes, the ball comes out quick with velocity. He had one ball that just sailed on him pretty bad for no reason, otherwise he threw downfield with authority. He did panic on that second sack IMO and bailed early. But I feel he's capable should we need him in this O.

I like our depth at running back, and thier fit to the zone blocking scheme. Goings had some nice runs, and it seems to fit him well as much as Foster. Even Shelton had some nice strong runs in the third team.

I love what McClover is showing. We should have depth at DE.

Looks like Morton may have the early lead for 4th corner?

 

Looking back over the first haldful of plays on D, first drive:

looking back I could remember some DE play, and some LB play, but not much DT. I couldn't remember seeing Jenkins. On tape, he comes alive.

first play, Jenkins gets penetration but the play goes away from him. Disengaging just a little earlier would be nice, but I still do like getting in the backfield. It's when it takes him out of the play I don't like. Also, it keeps him from being an easy doubleteam that he's always playing outside shade- the C has to work to get there or the G has to slide while on Jenkins, which is awfully hard to do.
Davis plays a non-eagled SLB and fakes blitz. Giants bunch right side and run to that side; mcClover gives up contain a little bit early but has good pursuit, getting to the ball around the LOS. Anderson, on slow motion, actually fights off Snee? in space and gets there to lay a shoulder. Nice work, JA.



Second play, Jenkins again gets penetration, it's pass. Kemo actually gets a few steps upfield before the 2nd blocker gets there, in a real game he's not going to get a doubleteam.
Davis again goes non-eagled and blitzes this time, but brings himself inside of Peppers, who goes a little too wide apparently intentionally. Davis gets picked up fairly easily, Seward is delaying, but gets picked up, which is probably where Kemo's 2nd man comes from. Seward brushes off Kemo before he gets there, apparently trying to come in unnoticed but too late. Anderson plays center under-zone, McClover plays the sideline zone so I'm guessing this is a C3 with Gamble, Cooper, Harris underneath the other zone, and the other CB playing man technique deep. Eli finds the open man easily. McClover didn't get out there fast, but catches a back with the ball, even if it's the FB.

Cute little zone blitz play that I hope we don't see in-season.

1st down, 3 wide plus Shockey, ace run to RG, and the two guys responsible take it on. Kemo, Seward. Seward is met in the hole by the FB and holds it up, Kemo gets off the block and lunges toward Jacobs. Really, he should've kicked it outside. Wasn't nickel personnel - Anderson is on the slot, Seward and Davis are the LB. Guess they took 2 TE and made it look like trips.

Davis lines up outside Peppers again - don't know if that's to get a look at him directly on the TE or what. One thing that jumps out at you - and has since preseason o2 tape - is that Peppers gets off the ball so fast, but Jenkins usually beats him. McClover held his ground OK for an undersized guy.
Run off left tackle. Anderson knifes inside and beats a guard to get to the FB. Problem is the FB does ride anderson off and Anderson doesn't just make a pile. Still, Seward takes advantage and nails Jacobs, and Harris cleans up.

3rd down, and all 4 linemen are cocked outside. Odd thing, though, is that McClover is pinned back so far his left knee is on the ground. That's just...odd. good rush everywhere, Manning overthrows his man, hard to see what's going on with the first team pass D but good enough. the D's fine anyway. Even with three starters out by design, we're potent.


our O
first down twins left broken I, Smitty's the slot. Smith runs a hook, Hoover runs through the line and does same. King helps passblock and seamlessly goes out for a pattern as well. Wharton had Osi handled, but Osi saw the 3 step and puts his hands up to bat down the swing pass. Bland play, but with various options. Good pass blocking.

2nd down, pretty basic two tight, single back balanced formation, Foster gets the open handoff from the right and bends it back left but has the option. Wish I had an endzone angle, but looks like both tights and both tackles engage the DEs in doubleteams. Playside, Wharton comes off the block to go after the OLB, and King (?) turns Osi inside. Nothing but room. Deshaun simply doesn't hesitate, but slides across formation and a basic zone run becomes an outside the tackles counter. Deeper downfield, Smitty rides his corner upfield a bit and at the last second disengages to smack the safety. Neat.

3rd down, 3 WR, Colbert with Smith inside, Carter other side. Carter comes tward formation, trails King off the snap and stops underneath, catches for first down. Simple stop route. Conversion.

 

yes to all.

 

1st down. 3 WR, TE is left as are twins. Colbert alone to right.

I notice they've only used Hoover once so far.

Giants blitz, as noted by Kiwanuka off Umenyiora's butt and the SS being up. Jake makes change at the line. Looks like the opposite of the other open handoff play but to the left - looks like Foster's supposed to turn it right on a counter and just doesn't, eats the ball and goes down around the line. Hard to do a lot against that.

2nd, 2 backs. Giants look to load the line again, 6 men on the line. Only Kiwanuka comes; looks like a non-handoff fake type play action, as Hoover and Foster come right. Line shifts protection to left (Wharton is doing a good job). Foster actually struggles a bit with Kiwanuka, losing his footing. Jake steps up (good). Hoover slips Kiwanuka to Foster, comes across on a diagonal route, catches for a shot gain. Looks like clearout routes to free Hoover. Good enough, 3 yards. DOesn't look as open from the QB point of view as it does from sideline camera, but it's there. Still, 2nd and 10, you need more than that.

3rd down, trips right (King, Colbert, Carter) with Smith left. Looks like it's setting up combo routes (I like this - we did so little of this for years). Wharton jumps, ref says Osi made him. Good enough.


Cue to Davidson in the booth. Really would rather him be on the sideline leading things, but if JD and McCoy have a good relationship, good enough, and Skipper always did a lot of administration.

3rd/2 -

two wides, two tights, Foster. Gaines tight, King wing, by the playbook this is Load right. King snaps outward on the flat route, which moves the two zone LBs that way to roll toward him. that leaves Gaines open on a basic curl, gets tackled not long after the ball gets there by Pierce, but converts.


same formation on first down except it's slot left, smith as the slot is in motion. Same TEs, alignment, and same combo route. King is the quick target now, on a 3 step. Foster almost gets in the way of Delhomme's throw and ducks, King turns around slow and bobbles the ball to drop it.
One thing to note, Wharton faces Osi and drops to get his knees, and Gross simply slides Joseph directly out of the way. No huge dropstep on this play, and none noticed so far.

2nd down - slot left I, Carter in motion toward formation, and away. Handoff is right, both backs right, and both backs come back left, counter. Hoover cuts back left early but Foster doesn't do it until he hits right tackle, but still 5 yards deep. At this point, the LBs and everyone but Osi (held outside by Wharton) are flowing right and Foster cuts back. 9 yards before he's tackled by the guy Carter was blocking. I can see where Jarrett can make a difference, blocking, if he's out there.

Shitty TV coverage gives us only our 2nd endzone look so far on O and we see Wharton/Wahle combo, Hartwig one on one, Bridges/Gross combo, King on the right end. Wahle comes off to get the LB, who's pulled up and ends up taking on Hoover. Wahle takes on the SS instead.

Goings this time. Double TE right again, I backs, simple man run to the left away from strength. Needs 1, gets 3. Conversion, and by run.

gun, 5 wide out of 3 wide personnel. From L-R - Smith, Foster, line, Gaines, Colbert, Carter. Gross gets a bit of a drop step on Joseph, but looks to handle him. Still, Joseph has a good jump and gets a little ahead of him. Jake looks at Smith, Joseph looks to have a hand close to Jake when he throws to Smith's out route. Like to think Jake threw it away because a) Smith was doubled, if loosely, or b) pressure. It's possible he was jsut throwing way too high, but he didn't do this again.

2nd/10, twins L, slot motion, I. Draw, right up the middle, Hoover releases immediately, line shows passblocking except Gross, who takes the RDT through and past the hole. Foster chops for a second as if settling in to pick up a blitzer and then takes the draw. Good blocking downfield by Hoover taking on the LB, by Wahle releasing, and by 99 whiffing. Foster almost gets tripped up at about 10yards but stays on his feet, takes contact and falls forward for 5 more.

I right, looks like a basic I-lead play left, Giants have 5-man line look with Kiwanuka on the line. Goings goes right up the gut, stutters at 3 yards deep and cuts right, where there's no one. Goings rumbles to the 5. Awesome. Not everybody's going to bite like this, but that's still neat. Aggressive defenses might have trouble stopping us.

1/goal, 3 wide + King/Goings. King and Colbert go up to the goal and stop, looks like Carter runs a post, as does Smith. Smith leads his man, jumps for the ball. Score.

I like this shit.

 

I thought Bridges did a pretty solid job. I think it was one Goings pretty long runs where he pulled at just knocked someone on their ass. Looked like he might have been a little behind the play, but still a good block nonetheless. On one of Deshuan's early run's it was great to see Wahle 10 years past the LOS finishing off some safety. Nice to finally see Hartwig as well.

It was also evident that the Giants will struggle alot on D this year. They looked bad. Kiwanuka is def. out of position. Poor CB play.

Goings looked faster than he had in the past. On the Stevie touchdown Colbert got gobbled up by a linebacker it looked like, although he might have been open for a second.

No idea what to make of Biddle, two touchdowns, but its hard to really give him props for them.

Moderatley pleased with Shelton, had some tacklers actually slide off of him and finished some runs strong.

Strait and Morton looked pretty good as well. It'll be a good battle between the two of them for the 4th corner.

Rosario will be helpful for us this year. Gaines even looked pretty decent.

Real heads up play by Richard Marshall on the sidelines.

If I ever see us hand the ball to Marlion Jackson 5 times in a row again I will throw a beer through the tv.

 

Thanks Mag.

What is eagle/non-eagle?

 

Vs

 

used to be, 4-3 style OLBs were outside.
Then the Eagle defense, of Fritz Shurmur's design, came about. Wasn't really a 4-3, because the middle man was back in with the tackles. Nonetheless, OLBs in the 4-3 that we'd know now are considered eagled (inside the DE) or not eagled (I don't know what you'd traditionally call it). Without the eagle call, the OLB is often on the line, standing up, but not necessarily; it would usually put the end and tackle next to each other. Eagling only one OLB, and moving everyone over in an odd-front look, is a good way to crowd the line and give a 3-4 look with 4-3 personnel.

technically, the modern 4-3 was initially called the double eagle defense.

In short, inside the end, eagled. Outside, isn't. Can be on the line, flanking, whatever.