Is God and Allah the same person?

I agree with you, Sly, but couldn't it be argued that salvation by grace supercedes Mosaic Law, and thereby renders much (not all) of Old Testament (i.e. Torah) doctrine invalid?

Agreed.

You've made this point before, and I still think it has a lot of credibility. Both claim roots in the Old and New Testaments, but both include later writings that when in conflict with the Bible, override it. And both writings were borne from the unwitnessed revelation/experience of a single man (as far as I know).

 

My biggest problem with Catholicism is (per Sadic) the word of the Pope supercedes the Bible.

Mormons do believe in the Bible (they tend to be very proud of their "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints" moniker) and claim to be Christians. The problem is there are subtle differences in interpretation of Biblical doctrine (i.e. changes in the identities of God the Father, Jesus, Adam, etc.) that apparently are corroborated in the Book of Mormon. There are also practices and traditions the Mormons observe that have evolved over the decades that stand in stark contrast to New Testament principles (salvation after death, the whole 'temple' concept, etc.), based solely on the interpretations of Mormon clerics seemingly with little or no accountability to the Bible itself.

I suppose the fundamental difference I see between Christianity/Judaism and Mormonism/Christianity is that Christianity has much more historical, scientific, and spiritual evidence to support it. The other difference is that Christianity is actually predicted and anticipated in the Old Testament. The New Testament gives no such forewarning of additional revelations of prophets to come, such as Muhammad or Joseph Smith.

 

The history of it goes like this: The early Christians used a set of scriptures called the Septuagint, it was basically a Greek translation of Jewish Scripture. This text was adopted and called the Old Testament of the Christian Bible. However, around 100AD, Jewish rabbis revised their Scripture and established an official canon of Judaism which excluded some portions of the Greek Septuagint. The material excluded was a group of 15 Jewish books. Christians did not follow the revisions of Judaism and continued to use the text of the Septuagint.

Protestant reformers in the 1500s decided to follow the official canon of Judaism for the Old Testament rather than the Septuagint, and the excluded material was palced in a separate section of the Bible called the Apocrypha. Protestant Bibles included the Apocrypha until the mid-1800s, but eventually dropped.

So I guess, what I'm saying is, with all the revisions (this one and the Council of Nicaea) and so much material excluded for both religous and political reasons, how can you claim that any single text is the true and whole Word of God? It seems to me that with 2,000 years and several translations there would be some loss. I'm not saying that the Bible is wrong, in fact, I believe in it, but I cannot accept that it is the one true book and that Modern Christianity is the one true faith when so much has been altered from its beginnings. The most that I can say is that the only real Christians are those who follow Christ's teachings and strive to be Christ-like. And that means being forgiving and compassionate, not vengeful and hateful. Too many so-called Christians do not follow Christ's teachings.

 

Interesting...

Any idea why the rabbis decided at that point in history to canonize their Scripture? If memory serves, that was less than a generation after John wrote his revelation on Patmos, and probably less than a decade after he died. Smells a little like a revisionist history conspiracy to me.

Agreed.

 

There is not one "true religion". There is however one true gospel message. That message is that Christ was the son of God and he died for the sins of mankind. All men are sinners and must accept Christ and ask him for salvation in order to go to heaven. That is one basic truth that any religion must accept in order to be valid. I agree that there are lots of different beliefs and sects within christianity but if they do not accept the gospel message then they are not truly christian. All of the other issues that people disagree on do not matter that much.

I also believe that any religion that does not hold the gospel to be true is keeping its followers from finding the truth. Those religions are therefore instruments of evil even if they are responsible for many good deeds. They are like placing a band aid on a snake bite. It may appear to help the wound but with out the anti-venom they are not going to help you.

 

I do not believe that sadic is correct about this. It is my understanding that Catholics think that the Pope is God's representative on Earth, but I don't think he trumps the Bible.

 

Christ's message of salvation is not to be "Christ like" it is to ask his forgiveness for his sins and repent of them. Attempting to be Christ like is something all christians should strive for but it is not the main message of Christ.

The King James 1611 version of the bible has been the same since 1611. I believe it to be most valid version of the bible. However regardless of which version you use the central message of the gospel is unchanged.

 

The rabbis decided to canonize their scriptures because a large amount of material had leaked into it from the Greek-speaking world. They took out a lot of non-Hebrew stuff, i.e. less Jewish stuff, and added other, older work in. The result was a new canon that formed the "official" Jewish scripture from then on and founded Modern Judaism. Many Christians didn't follow the revision.

The belief that the Pope is God's representative goes further than that in that he cannot do any wrong because he is directly imbued with the Holy Spirit and it will not allow him to err. This belief has wavered considerably over time, but that was a central pillar of Catholicism for many centuries.

 

I have never read that. Wouldn't that belief make him a Second Coming, since the only man without sin was Christ?

 

FWIW

http://catholicoutlook.com/objpope.html